Geske

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  1. About the να before λιώνει: it's true that να is maddeningly versatile. In this case να λιώνει expresses the continuous process, in French they have it very neatly too: "en train de fondre". In English it means "in the ongoing process of dissolving" which of course is too ugly to be written. As for γλυκό σαν πετυμεσι I think you are looking for more than there is. He's simply calling the poison (all that's wrong with their relationship) "sweet like syrup", that is, unhealthy, cloying, sickening, even addictive. And "what love put into our hands" is dissolving in it, that is, whatever good they had is being absorbed into the poison. I agree with that.
  2. We knew it as a Dalaras-Papakonstantinou duet and then Marinella came and out-rocked the rocker. ΠΡΙΝ ΤΟ ΤΕΛΟΣ_____||_____ BEFORE THE END Μουσική: Battisti - Mogol_____||_____ Music: Battisti-Mogol Στίχοι: Λίνα Νικολακοπούλου_____||_____ Lyrics: Lina Nikolakopoulou Στα τραγούδια που λέγαμε οι δυο μας οι φωνές χαμηλώσαν_____||_____ In the songs we used to sing together, the two of us, the voices would soften χαραγμένη καρδιά στο παγκάκι που μετά την προδώσαν_____||_____ Into the little bench, a heart was scratched, which they later betrayed μια φορά μου 'χες πει δεν μπορεί θα το νιώσανε κι άλλοι_____||_____ Once upon a time you had told me "it can't be - there must be others who feel it too πριν το τέλος πως μοιάζει η σιωπή σαν αγάπη μεγάλη_____||_____ just before the end, how much the silence is like a great love" Σιδερένια η σκάλα και μου 'λεγες θα μείνουμε λίγοι_____||_____ The stair was made of iron and you were telling me "only a few of us will remain" πήρε η νύχτα να πέφτει βαθιά κι ο αέρας με πνίγει_____||_____ The night has started to fall heavily and the air is choking me μια φορά μου 'χες πει δεν μπορεί θα το νιώσανε κι άλλοι_____||_____ Once upon a time you had told me "it can't be - there must be others who feel it too πριν το τέλος πως μοιάζει η σιωπή σαν αγάπη μεγάλη_____||_____ just before the end, how much the silence is like a great love" Κι εγώ που ζω για πάντα εδώ κι όλο φεύγω το τέλος πριν να δω_____||_____ And I, living here forever, always leaving before seeing the end, κάθε νύχτα που περνάει γυρίζω ξανά σκοτάδι γίνομαι και παραδίνομαι_____||_____ as each night passes I come back again, I turn into darkness and am betrayed στο ρυθμό σου που καίει ακόμα αυτό το σώμα που μένει χρόνια χωρίς σκιά_____||_____ into the rhythm of you, which keeps on consuming this body, years now without a shadow κάθε νύχτα που περνάει σαν ταινία κι ό,τι ζήσαμε προβάλλεται με φόντο την πλατεία_____||_____ As each night passes like a movie all we lived is projected on the background of the square Κάθε νύχτα που περνάει πάντα εδώ_____||_____ As each night passes, always here Κι όλο φεύγω πριν μείνουμε μόνοι το τέλος μη δω_____||_____ and always leaving before we are left alone, so as not to see the end.
  3. I've been listening to Arvanitaki's version, these days - not Dalaras, but still excellent if I may......... μου κρατούσες το χέρι ότι ζούμε μου λες δεν μου φτάνει || You were holding my hand saying "just being alive is not enough for me" or possibly, if ότι is a typo for ό,τι : μου κρατούσες το χέρι ότι ζούμε μου λες δεν μου φτάνει || You were holding my hand saying that "that which we are living now is not enough for me"
  4. I really don't know how to answer you but here's the best I can do (it's from "klirothika", the song you asked for...) Παίζω κι ας χάσω παίζω να μάθω_____||_____ I'm in the game, even if I lose! I'm in the game to learn, ..... και ίσως να 'μαι ο τυχερός_____||_____ and maybe I will be the lucky one.
  5. Your side of the the Atlantic, yes. On this one - no.
  6. Hristaki, I don't know what you based this on, but you have been misinformed, it's not true. For one, here in Holland, where people listen to "world music" a LOT, this is what you find: - in "normal" record stores: nothing - in "good" record stores: in the section 'world music', the Bregovic record and/or one or two 'best of' type records - at a very good specialist store which stocks World Music and nothing else, I checked the catalogue, and they have 11 Dalaras titles , out of about 270 records under 'Greece' - and no, they can't order Dalaras' other records, I asked.
  7. For a good joke on me, follow the story of the translation of the song Κληρώθηκα , from the topic where Christo asks for a translation, and where I delay making it, because the verb in the title is a bother to translate - to the topic where I finally post the translation, with the line that cost me sleepless hours (not quite _nights_, but still...) - and it's wrong! Oh, I know it's all in a day's work, part of the game, and that only people who don't make translations never mistranslate anything, but jeeeeeeez do I hate it... Thank heaven for Christos (the one from Thessaloniki, not to be confused with the other) who comes and tells me where I went wrong..........
  8. By special request: and edited with help from Χρήστος, merci beaucoup! ΚΛΗΡΩΘΗΚΑ_____||_____ Drawn in the lottery Μουσική: Γιώργος Ζήκας_____||_____ Music: Giorgos Zikas Στίχοι: Γιώργος Ζήκας_____||_____ Lyrics: Giorgos Zikas Παίζω κι ας χάσω παίζω να μάθω_____||_____ I'm in the game, even if I lose! I'm in the game to learn, γιατί η αγάπη είναι λαχνός_____||_____ because love is a sweepstake number, κλήρος ριγμένος στην κληρωτίδα_____||_____ a ticket thrown into the lottery wheel, και ίσως να 'μαι ο τυχερός_____||_____ and maybe I will be the lucky one. Κληρώθηκα κληρώθηκα_____||_____ I won the draw, I won the draw, και στην αγάπη δόθηκα_____||_____ and I've given myself up to love, κληρώθηκα κληρώθηκα_____||_____ I won the draw, I won the draw, σε σένα παραδόθηκα_____||_____ and I've given myself up to you. Παίζω και χάνω μα τι να κάνω_____||_____ I play, and I lose, but what can I do about it? αφού η ζωή του καθενός_____||_____ Since every person's life φύλλο κρυμμένο μες στην παρτίδα_____||_____ is the hidden card - among the players π' αλλάζει θέση διαρκώς_____||_____ it changes place all the time. Κληρώθηκα κληρώθηκα_____||_____ I won the draw, I won the draw, και στην αγάπη δόθηκα_____||_____ and I've given myself up to love, κληρώθηκα κληρώθηκα_____||_____ I won the draw, I won the draw, σε σένα παραδόθηκα_____||_____ and I've given myself up to you. Translator's notes: "κληρώθηκα" is one of those highly efficient - but confusing - Greek verbs that can be almost untranslatable. The active form, κληρώνω, means "to draw", but only and specifically as when speaking of the prize in a lottery, raffle, sweepstake. Here the passive is used, "to be drawn (in the lottery)" - the dictionary example is «κληρώθηκε ο αριθμός μου», "my number has been drawn" (i.e. has come out and won). Seemingly the first person «κληρώθηκα» can be used metaphorically, as if the speaker himself (not just his ticket) came out of the lottery wheel. The following verbs, δόθηκα - παραδόθηκα, are also in the passive; they could be taken as "I was given (up)" or, in the reflexive use of the Greek passive, as "I gave myself (up)" - in this situation it's the second that makes sense, someone winning the big prize (i.e. love) and giving himself up to totally.
  9. NOW you're telling me! I had thought of this translation, about δόθηκα I knew, but I couldn't find good support / examples for this use of the passive form of κληρώνω, so I rejected it. I'll revise the translation asap.
  10. The translations in that booklet are full of mistakes - even worse than mine. Especially in the not-straightforward songs such as this one. Just a friendly warning...
  11. Well, I wasn't talking about expecting "too much", more about expecting the wrong things. If you go to a concert in 2006 expecting to see Dalaras as he was in 1990, you can be sure you will be disappointed - and your disapointed expectations are likely to "get in the way" and prevent you from enjoying whatever there is in the concert that actually is to your taste. And that's a pity
  12. « «Εμένα μη μου λέτε για τάσεις επιστροφής στην παράδοση - γιατί πάντα αυτό δεν έκανα;» απαντάει στην (ανάλογη) ερώτηση ο Γιώργος Νταλάρας. » Πολύ ωραίο και πολύ χαρακτηριστικό... Να μην είναι η παράδοση μνημείο που (θα έπρεπε να) προσπαθεί ο σημερινός μουσικός να μιμείται την τελειότητά της, να είναι πιο πολύ ένα πηγάδι που πάει να πίνει όταν διψά, να εμπνευστεί, να δροσιστεί... «...οι μουσικές μας που έχουν συγγένεια - και δεν εννοώ μόνο την Αλβανία, αλλά όλα τα Βαλκάνια. Τα δικά τους μοιάζουν δικά μας και τα δικά μας δικά τους.» Έτσι μου φάνηκε, απ' τα λίγα που έχω ακούσει, και χαίρομαι να το λέει αυτός! «...H γλώσσα δεν παίζει τόσο σημαντικό ρόλο πια, ο κόσμος διψάει για νέες μουσικές, όλοι είναι έτοιμοι για συνεργασίες. » ΕΠΙΤΕΛΟΥΣ! ****************************************** Three quotes from the interview in Ta Nea posted by Anna, where Dalaras talks about his forthcoming album and his collaboration with the Dasho Kourti and also with Bregovic, with thanks to her and apologies for not translating it entirely. «"Don't you talk me about 'tendencies to return to tradition' - because, isn't that what I've been doing all the time?" is Dalaras' answer to that question» I like it, and it's very like him... not having 'traditional music' as a monument whose perfection today's musicians (ought to) try to imitate, rather letting tradition be a well where they come back drink whenever they are thirsty, for inspiration, for refreshment... «... their music and our are of one family - and I don't mean only Albania, I mean all the Balkans. Theirs seems like its ours, and ours seems like it's theirs... » That's what it seemed like to me, it's good to hear him say it. «...every record from Universal is released in at least 10 European countries. That is the reason why I decided to go to them.» « ...language does not play such an important part anymore, the people are thirsty for new music, everyone is ready to work together.» AT LAST! Go for it Giorgo!!! Not all of them deserve you, but some of them sure do
  13. Anna! MERCI!!!!!!!!!! I was so disappointed to have missed him in Utrecht a week or so ago, found out too late and it was sold out... so, I got myself a ticket for Amsterdam, anyone else going is welcome to contact me for having a drink toegether before or after the concert. Bonus: the "Paradiso" in Amsterdam is arguably the nicest concert place I've been to anywhere. It's a reconverted church (built in 1880), with good acoustics, large enough for a good audience but small enough for an intimate atmosphere, also it's famous in its way, everyone who is anyone has played there.
  14. After a few days away, this topic took a while to read... Christo, your story is truly sad - a Dalaras concert is something that should be right, and good, and wonderful, and when it goes wrong it's horrible, past describing. I think all of us who care deeply about his music and himself have had (or will have, sooner or later) this horrible experience, of a concert where everything that can possibly go wrong - does. Where even things that can't go wrong do go wrong. If you look at it coldly, even with all the Dalaras magic in the world, it must go wrong sometimes. To comfort you a little, maybe: sometimes you just have bad luck, everything goes wrong from the moment you leave home to go to the concert, and then by the time you get there you can't enjoy whatever is good about it - but this does not necessarily mean that the whole situation, the whole concert, is necessarily as bad as you feel it to be at that time. Maybe it is, but maybe it isn't. There is the acoustics of the concert hall, and the acoustics of our own ears... Anna writes earlier in this topic Christo, just to tell you, if you would have been on my seat at Megaro Athens, Trianda Hall the 11st of Nov. last year, were Dalaras did the Axion Esti you would have left the venue with tears in your eyes because the acoustics were extremely bad and his voice was nothing!!!! Well, I read the sentence three times, I couldn't believe my eyes.... because I was at that concert too and I was so wrapped in his voice and the music to notice the acoustics, I was out out of the world, possibly the most shattering concert experience of my life. So, who's wrong? Nobody - on the contrary. There is what he sings and there is what each listener hears - and these two are not the same. It's not something that can be discussed very objectively, I think. If I might give you something like "advice", it would be to "avoid expectations"; I mean, you went to the concert wishing/expecting to hear a certain kind of songs, basically "Dalaras as you knew him". This is natural, but it is not wise. That Dalaras does not exist anymore - like it or not, time does not not stand still, and Dalaras even less! You know, what struck me, when I read what he chose to sing, is how much of his "Orfeas" repertoire he did. Not 'how little' - 'how much'. More generally, I am struck once more by the huge differences between one audience and the other. It's one of the questions I would really, really like him to talk about some day: what differences does he perceive between Athens and Atlantic city, Amsterdam and Montreal, London and Boston, Thessaloniki now and Thessaloniki 15 years ago?
  15. With great, great, GREAT thanks to Maria de Los Angeles, who wrote out the lyrics for us... a whole night, and ten of us searching the World Wide Web, and not finding them! So she came and saved us. Then I couldn't resist temptation and tried to translate them. Now I promise you, I don't know any spanish at all, but I happen to own a Spanish dictionnary, and when you're good enough with dictionaries, in writing, you can pretend, quite convincingly... Anyway. Maria said this translation is OK, and believe me, if she had not, I would never ever have posted it. P.S. 23 April 2006: thanks to Kapetanios and Maria, the translation is being updated now, the "missing line" is solved Amor Amor_____||_____ Love, love Μουσική: Arnaud Taieb_____||_____ Music: Arnaud Taieb Στίχοι :Arnaud Taieb_____||_____ Lyrics: Arnaud Taieb Amor,_____||_____ Love ya no corre sangre por mis venas_____||_____ no blood runs in my veins anymore amor,_____||_____ Love las cosas de la vida nos separaron_____||_____ the facts of life keep us apart amor,_____||_____ Love eres el sol que alumbra mi memoria,_____||_____ you are the sun that lights up my memory eres mia,_____||_____ you are mine me siento solito, abandonado del mundo._____||_____ I feel all alone, abandoned by [all] the world Te necesito, yo te quiero,_____||_____ I need you, I love you mi vida sin ti es un desierto,_____||_____ my life without you is a desert amor, amor, amor._____||_____ love, love, love Amor, tu eres la estrella de mi cielo_____||_____ Love, you are the star of my heaven amor,_____||_____ Love quiero amarte con todo mi sentimiento,_____||_____ I want to love with all my feeling si, todo,_____||_____ yes, all amor,_____||_____ love de terciopelo son tus caricias, tus caricias,_____||_____ of velvet are your caresses, your caresses, vente conmigo_____||_____ Come with me te doy el amor que yo tengo muy dentro._____||_____ I give you the love I have inside me Te necesito, yo te quiero,_____||_____ I need you, I love you mi vida sin ti es un desierto_____||_____ my life without you is a desert amor, amor, amor._____||_____ love, love, love Amor eterno a mi lado,_____||_____ Love, eternal, by my side amor, contigo, contigo..._____||_____ love, with you, with you amor, te doy mi amor._____||_____ love, I give you my love Te necesito, yo te quiero,_____||_____ I need you, I love you mi vida sin ti es un desierto, amor!_____||_____ my life without you is a desert, love!
  16. thanks to Kapetanios and Maria, the translation is updated now, the "missing line" is solved
  17. I hope this helps http://www.dalaras.com/forum/index.php?act...7fb95e54d5a28e1 and I never miss a chance to tell everyone "if you haven't read the Odyssey yet, get it and read it!" In English I recommend the translation of E.V.Rieu (published in Penguin).
  18. well, that's the toughest I've had in a long time, but here it is: http://www.dalaras.com/forum/index.php?s=8...t=ST&f=9&t=3210 (since this topic has gone off-topic entirely, I've started a new one, complete with standard format title, in hopes that those who want it will find it most easily that way) (and so we can go on going off-topic in here :B )
  19. By special request: Τα βεγγαλικά σου μάτια_____||_____ Your cold fire eyes Στίχοι: Μιχάλης Μπουρμπούλης_____||_____ Lyrics: Michalis Bourboulis Μουσική: Στάμος Σέμσης_____||_____ Music: Stamos Semsis ’ναψα όλα τα φώτα κι έδωσα παράσταση_____||_____ I lit all the lights and performed the show *. σαν πεθάνει η αγάπη δε γνωρίζει ανάσταση_____||_____ When love dies, it knows no resurrection. Τα βεγγαλικά σου μάτια φέγγουν σαν το φώσφορο_____||_____ Your cold fire eyes - they shine like phosphor, σαν νυχτερινά καράβια που περνούν το Βόσπορο_____||_____ like ships in the night crossing the Bosporus. Έκλεισες το φως και πήγες έγινες αόρατη_____||_____ You shut off the light and left, you became invisible, νέφος που το πήρε ο αέρας σε μια πόλη αυτόματη_____||_____ a cloud gone with the wind in an automated city Τα βεγγαλικά σου μάτια ένα ολοκαύτωμα _____||_____ Your cold fire eyes are an all-consuming blaze * και η μοναξιά να πέφτει σαν βροχή στο πάτωμα_____||_____ and there's loneliness which keeps falling like rain upon the floor. Είμαι πια εγκλωβισμένος στ' άρωμά σου στ' όνομά σου_____||_____ By now I am imprisoned inside your scent, inside your name, και στα μάτια ναι στα μάτια τα ψυχρά βεγγαλικά σου_____||_____ and inside your eyes, your cold eyes, sparkling fireworks. Τα βεγγαλικά σου μάτια φέγγουν σαν το φώσφορο_____||_____ Your cold fire eyes - they shine like phosphor, σαν νυχτερινά καράβια που περνούν το Βόσπορο_____||_____ like ships in the night crossing the Bosporus Translator's notes: * έδωσα παράσταση: "the show must go on". * βεγγαλικά μάτια: the word "vengaliko" is confusing; it means "from Bengal", but also "fireworks". There might be some historical reason for this, since in French, for example, the kind of pyrotechnic device that produces a column of sparkling fire for about one minute is called "feu de Bengale". I have translated it as "cold fire", which means any light or sparks that look like fire but don't cause burns; for example, it's used for phosphorescent plankton; it's also the name for the kind of fireworks that produce lots of sparkles, which however do not "burn" (cause burns on skin or clothes). Example: the sparkler-sticks sometimes seen in the hands of Dalaras fans during certain specially beloved songs . * ολοκαύτωμα : I've seen several translations of this song, and all had this word as "holocaust". But: the two used to be equivalent, but no longer are. The original meaning is literal: «burn up everything entirely»; it's a technical term used in religions that sacrifice animals and burn (parts of) them on the altar to honour the gods - example: Ancient Greece. I think "burnt offering" is also used in English. Now, it has been used in all languages to describe «genocide by crematory». In Greek it's original meaning is still clear, as it is so evidently made up of "ολο" + "καίω" ("all" + "to burn"). In all other languages, it's now impossible to use in its old meaning, except maybe in a technical text on Antiquity. So, I put "all-consuming fire" (and then changed it "blaze" so as not to have "fire" twice in one line). And a personal note: «η μοναξιά να πέφτει σαν βροχή στο πάτωμα» is one of my most favourite verses anywhere, anywhen. And I've no idea why...
  20. While looking for something else I stumbled on this: .....A phosphorescent wave on a tropical sea is a cold fire Don't cross the line The pattern of moonlight on the bedroom floor is a cold fire Don't let me down The flame at the heart of a pawnbroker's diamond is a cold fire Don't break the spell The look in your eyes as you head for the door is a cold fire It's the chorus of the song "Cold fire" by the Canadian band "Rush". Different sound, same fire...
  21. And a wonderful photograph. You bet! I'm a fan of hers Does anyone share my feeling that maybe Dalaras is "talent-scouting" ("head-hunting"?) new talent in the "composition" department?
  22. In my opinion, the site does not need a "face-lift" (change of looks), though it could use an update (bringing information up to the present, adding material). And the forum would not benefit from any "captain" (moderator, whatever), there's no work here for such a person; the only thing might be to clear away one-post-topics with zero information content, that take up space and make it hard to find the informations/topics one is looking for. When they gave Dalaras that Kennedy award for his work for Cyprus, there was a quote on it that he really liked, what was it? «Do not ask what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country» , if I'm not mistaken? I'm not always enthusiastic about "countries", but say "forum" instead and I'll cheer.
  23. case in point: a cliche and an idiom are not the same thing... btw I wasn't refering to the (very real) problem of translating Greek idioms properly into English, but to the problem of wanting to use a specific, idiomatic, construction in the English translation, and knowing half the readers will not know what it means. In effect, when the target audience is international, the usable part of English decreases sharply. Making mistakes is fine by me, passing them off as "local usage" is not - and evolving a "local usage" for use in translations whose primary aim was (I thought...) to make songs accessible to the whole world is a contradiction in terms if I ever saw one. I'm not saying Greek-influenced English doesn't exist (it does), nor that it shouldn't exist (it has many uses and fine ones), I'm only saying it shouldn't be encouraged , and certainly not in translations.
  24. Telegraph style - I'm too sleepy Frustration - is part of the job. "The salt in the porridge" as we say in my country. There is "those who know a little Greek" and "those who know how to use a dictionnary and grammar book" - these are a very small minority. Ask Christo. I absolutely refuse to attempt to re-create a poem. I am not a poet. Story-teller yes, translator yes, poet no. Anyway, though my english is serviceable, it's definitely nowhere near good enough to write poetry. BTW, let's think of translations we've read: how often is being "poetic" or "atmospheric" a cover for "not having found the right word"? whole-hearted agrement and loud applause - though there are a few cases where one might feel like giving a warning about a particular error, if it's tricky or interesting or something. Actually what I find hardest (except for the real "bones" like that κληρώθηκα) the fact that almost all readers have English for a second (or third, or fourth) language - that is, whose knowledge of words, constructions and (specially) idioms is limited.
  25. Because it's not accurate enough to my taste. "I was picked by fate" (no 'the') means, in English, that Destiny or Fate has Chosen the speaker for some mission or other - even if we want to use the words to express something else, that's what they already mean. No language is a virgin. Also "throwing" is off the mark - the meaning is "given to", "handed over to", maybe "awared to" (as in 'awarding a prize'). I haven't got any closer than "Love won the draw, I was handed over to it, I was given to you" . It's fairly (not very) close in meaning, but the construction of the sentence is very different and I don't like that, because these translations get used by many people who know a bit of Greek (a larger or smaller bit...) and they want to be able to relate the words of the translation to the words of the original. Hard to please? Me?????