vitaly2

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  1. Well, I am still in the dark about this song. There must be a story behind it.
  2. As most of the folk songs it's a bit enigmatic - hints on forgotten history and includes local expressions not easy to understand. One is τα μελιτζανιά να μην τα βάλεις πιά alluding at a jailbird (someone in and out of jail where the aubergine some perceive as purple, others as dark blue was worn) in particular, or at being not free, the sense of freedom-deprivation coming from outside (Turkish occupation?) or inside (such as being in love or poor or whatever). That latter reading can be perceived from another folk song, from Rodos: ΤΑ ΜΕΛΙΤΖΑΝΙΑ Πέρδικα της ακρογιαλιάς και ψάρι της θαλάσσης -τα μελιτζανιά να μην τα βάλεις πιά- Μεσ' την καρδιά μ'εφύτρωσε δεντράκι με τους κλώνους -Ελενίτσα μου, Μπαξεβανίτσα μου- Ανθεί και βγάζει βάσανα καρπεί και βγάζει πόνους -θάλασσα περνώ μα δε σε λησμονώ - Τ'αηδόνια της ανατολής και τα πουλιά της δύσης -τα μελιτζανιά να μην τα βάζεις πιά - Ολά γλυκά θα κελαηδούν όταν θα μου μιλήσεις τα μελιτζανιά να μην τα βάζεις πιά xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx So, the song about Mr. Kostaki might be translated as follows. They've told me - Mr. Kostaki, come here - the upbeat people: - Stop wearing aubergine colors - That a better life - Mr. Kostaki, come here - you'll see when you are drunk. My duck, my goose - take my sins upon you. From that fountain source of my drinking water - Mr. Kostaki, come here - others drink now. And I don't pass on that lane anymore. I used to be a guest from heaven - Mr. Kostaki, come here - Now others are welcomed (there). Come, my mate, take my hand. Mr. Kostaki seems to be blaming himself for having stupidly trusted the smart people - and maybe lost his house? Or is the tap where he used to take his drinking water a metaphor? At least the dictionaries say that ducks and geese may be associated with someone who behaves as a simpleton or stupid. Mr. Kostaki was evidently duped into something. They said: come here and gave him a boot. Whatever is was, the situation is recognizable by many of us and therefore I am curious to know. Who can tell?
  3. This story is not small, even in a condensed (and hasty) translation. (From "Mi Espana Querida" by Antonio Burgos - but it's Juanito who speaks). My name is Juan Valderrama Blanca and I was born in 1916 in Torredelcampo, a little village very close to Jaen, where as a child I learned to sing while collecting olives in winter or while my father made me to take care of the mules that he used to buy and sell to the gypsies for the village festivals, during hot summer days. I was singing flamenco while still wearing short pants. I begun to record my songs on the plates that were played on a gramophone that you had to wind up manually: it was called "singing machine". I recorded three big anthologies from the flamenco history that are now played on digital discs. My songs had been played on crystal diode radios, and now they are heard on satellite TVs. I know all the flamenco styles, I recorded seven hundred songs and traveled to all the theatres of Spain and of the world during my seventy years of life as an artiste. I dedicated all my life to singing and learning from the great masters, and I believe that I've achieved in my genre the maximum of all that is possible. However, since I am a singer-songwriter that became known to the public through his own songs, my visiting card is El Emigrante. With El Emigrante I appeared as the first singer-songwriter in Spain. The first who came to the wide audience with a letter written by them, a letter in which they recognized feelings, joys and pains of the people. Such is the fame of El Emigrante that even Franco had requested an encore. I believe that I am the only artiste to which Franco, being an extremely serious man, clapped his hands and requested an encore. It happened in 1950 during a partridge hunt in the house of Don Francisco Aritio, in un estate near Madrid. Don Francisco Aritio was one of the richest people in Spain, investor in many enterprises. Dirty rich, of those capitals that were made after the war. I believe that a half of the Bank of Spain was his. And when we were working at the theater Calderon in Madrid, doing rehearsals of "Pena y Oro", a theater show that was written for me by Quintero, Leon and Quiroga, this Aritio organized a big festival in an estate with a mansion that belonged to San Martin de Valdeiglesias. The fest was a pretext for a partridge hunt that he organized for Franco who loved very much shotguns and fishing rods. The mansion was like a palace, with a salon that stretched from here to there. Maestro Quiroga invited us to come to the fest where the artistic part was organized by Don Fernando Fuertes de Villavicencio who was the chief of the civil affairs department of the Generalissimus and the right hand of Franco for such affairs. He would also invite artistes for participation in shows in the gardens of the Granja palace that were taking place every year on the eve of July 18 - a grand scale reception organized by the Caudillo for the diplomates and all the authorities. When I was notified by Quiroga that Fuertes de Villavicencio has invited us to the fest with the hunt I was busy with the rehearsals of Pena y Oro, feeling also lousy after a recent appendicitis surgery, and even the stiches they haven't removed yet. But who could refuse to go to a show of Franco? It was not a matter of free choice. At the hunt fest we were kept in a room on the second floor, and when it was our turn to sing they lead us into that immense salon, very luxury, with many pictures, namy lights, in which they had assembled some kind of a podium, with a piano below and a stage above for the artistes. And there he was, Franco, sitting in the salon, with his ministers, many in the military uniform, many adjutants with golden cords and a host of people dispersed over the grounds: Giardia Mora and others who were disguised in plain clothes. It was like in the palace of El Pardo, but actually just a partridge hunt in San Martin de Valdeiglesias. And when it was our time to sing we climbed up to the podium of that huge salon, Nino Ricardo with his guitar and myself. And Maestro Quiroga below at the piano, from whom we took confidence because he had prepared us for that plan of the Caudillo. Each artiste was to sing only one song. And me, feeling so lousy in front of so many uniforms with Franco in a peasant dress there in the front row, very serious, staring directly at me - I asked Quiroga before climbing up: - What will we be singing, maestro? And although this song was not written by Maestro Quiroga, is is for sure that it was requested by Fuertes de Villavicencio on behalf of Franco, since he said: - El Emigrante, Juan, of course El Emigrante... Ricardo played an introduction on the guitar, with the piano of Maestro Quiroga in the background, and there in front of Franco whose fault it was that so many Spaniards had to leave Spain and could not return and had to live far from their land, I started to sing the song that talked precisely about them, because at those times there were still no emigrants leaving for Germany with a knapsack to work, only the exiles who because of our tragedy dispersed all over the world. Cuando sali de mi tierra volvi la cara llorando porque lo que mas queria atras me lo iba dejando, llevaba por companera a mi Virgen de San Gil, un recuerdo y una pena y un rosario de marfil. Adios mi Espana querida, dentro de mi alma te llevo metia, y aunque soy un emigrante jamas en la vida yo podre olvidarte. I was applauded by those in the salon - the ministers, the military, the people of the same grand scale as the dinner of that hunt fest. And I saw even Franco himself to clap his hands in his condescending manner of a military. And I came down from the stage, and Fernando Fuertes de Villavicencio who was keeping constantly at our side, he gave me a push toward where Franco was sitting: - Go greet his Excellency, Juanito, greet his Excellency. And I approached the Caudillo, and Franco stretched out his hand, a gesture that he would do with such coldness, a small hand half closed, without expression of a feeling, and he said to me with that tiny chilly voice of his: - Valderrama, this song is very beautiful, very patriotic... - Thank you very much, Your Excellency, thank you very much. And Franco remained silent for a long time, without uttering a word, looking at me without moving a muscle on his face, and suddenly he goes: - Valderrama, would you be so kind to sing it one more time? I felt even more lousy than before. I could not figure it out. I thought, dying of fear: "He does it so he could understand better what I am saying in El Emigrante and he will put me in jail..." And Fuertes de Villavicendio, with much running back and forth and much grimacing: - Come on, Juanito, come on, and you, Ricardo, go up again, His Excellency wants to hear this song one more time... And I had to do an encore for Franco. Ricardo climbed up one more time to the stage with his guitar and Maestro Quiroga settled again at the piano and I sung again El Emigrante. I believe that not many artistes had to do an encore for Franco. While singing the second time it kept gnawing at me: "What is going to happen now when this uncle understands better and won't consider it so patriotic?" "Will he get an idea about putting me in jail?" And in my fear and my distraction I had recalled that night when I finished writing El Emigrante. The refrain came to me during a tour in the north, one day when we were performing in a theater of Ponferrada, and Nino Ricardo played me a beautiful improvisation to some verses that I was chanting. That melody almost brought to me ready the refrain of the song that expressed what I was feeling at the moment: Adios, mi Espana querida, dentro de mi alma te llevo metia... But the entire song was finished much later, and at a single stroke, as if my own heart was dictating it to me, during the same tour, after that Moorish but so Spanish night when I saw the tears of Spanish exiles in Tanger. Tanger was at the time like a little Paris, it was international. It did not belong to Spain as Tetuan, nor to France as Casablanca. It was held by the Great Powers that had won the World War, and all the languages were being spoken over there, and all the religions were being practiced: along with the Catholics and Muslims there were Jews, Indians, English and American Protestants, and each of them would close their business at those days dedicated to God, some on Friday, others on Saturday, others on Sunday. Tanger had nothing in common with the other parts of Morocco that I had gotten to know during my first tour before the war. Tanger was completely different from the Spanish cities of the protectorate, from Tetuan, Larache, Alcazarquivir. The other places were like Andalucia - backward as in Spain, full of the soldiers and barracks. And Tanger looked as at least France or the United States. In Tanger one was breathing freedom at forty miles length. It was at the time a megalopolis, and a completely free one, with businessmen from all the nations, temples of all the religions, without priests or military on the streets, with impressive avenues. That boulevard de Pasteur was like Les Champs d'Elysee or like the Fifth Avenue, having businesses with all the advanced things displayed in the window showcases: electrical, plastic, all that were not known here. Plexiglas, Coca-Cola, watches, Parker pens... Tanger was a contrabandist paradise. Cigarettes, magazines from all over the world, cafes with those grandiose terraces where people of all the races were speaking all the languages. It was a huge contrast for the Spaniards coming from where they still had ration cards, even for the tobacco... And there in Tanger, looking for freedom and prosperity, ended up many Spaniards after the war, fleeing Franco, jail or death by a shooting squad, and there they were trying to find refuge and to establish a living. They were my audience who came to see me in the theater, along with some Moroccans. All the world currency was available in Tanger: dollar, franc, sterling. Tanger was a megalopolis. The theater filled every night, the Cervantes theater. And meanwhile my discs were played all the day on the Radio Tanger, with the Madre Hermosa, and my photo was printed by the Espana de Tanger, a daily paper in Spanish where were working many our journalists who were forced to leave Madrid during the war and found refuge with Gregorio Corrochano, a famous corrida critic. It reached very profound, the realization that here in the Cervantes theater where we were about to perform, our tour came to its end, because Tanger was filled with Spaniards who were forced to leave after the war. I saw them to weep at the theater doors, clasping at me, chasing me when I was heading to the changing rooms through the artiste entrance: - Juanito, I am from Malaga, could you dedicate a song for me? - I've heard you to sing for my battalion in Andujar... And one of those who approached me was exactly a guy who saved my life in the battle of Brunete, where I found myself drafted along with many boys from my village. He assigned me to the CNT (National Labor Confederation) and sent as a soldier to the fortification works: Carlos Zimmerman. This anarchist who was the chief of CNT in Jaen and who had protected me a lot, was able to escape from Spain after the war. Otherwise, he would have been executed. He settled in Tanger and was working as an electrician which was his profession. We met, embraced and started to weep together because both of us knew well that he had no chance of going back to Spain while Franco was alive. It seemed to me that a half of Spain were refugees in Tanger, in that forced emigration, with all the commotion that I witnessed in the theater, all standing and applauding to the Spanish songs, without colored bands, but with tears in their eyes. Over there nobody was saying anything neither against the Franco regime nor in favor of it. Nothing but weeping with memories of our land: - Espana, Espana!. And the guitar, the singing, the "ole". It did not belong to Franco or to the Republic. Those people were just from Spain. They were Spain itself. They were memory of the land that they had to abandon. Their beloved Spain. Espana querida. And all this reached me in such a profound way, and it was such a painful truth that when I returned to the hotel that night, after having passed by those quarters of Zoco Grande, by the little Moroccan cafes, all dark, narrow streets, a different part of Tanger, the Moroccan, not international, - I grabbed a sheet of paper and started to write, to fill the missing lines into the song, since up to the moment we with Nino Ricardo haven't written nothing but the refrain. I did it at one stroke. While writing in the hotel I still saw all those people weeping at the doors of the Cervantes theater, their tears and laments: - Mi Espana, Juan, and my children, they remained in Cartagena... All that penetrated so deep inside me that the song just erupted. Yo soy un pobre emigrante y traigo a esta tierra extrana en mi pecho un estandarte con los colores de Espana... And when at the hunt fest in that grand mansion of San Martin de Valdeiglesias I was singing an encore of El Emigrante for Franco, the tears of those exiles could not leave my thoughts.
  4. Μπορεί να γίνει ένα τραγούδι - πολύ όμορφο Πριν τους αλλάξει ο Χρόνος Λυπήθηκαν μεγάλως στόν άποχωρισμό των. Δεν το θελαν αυτοί, ήταν η περιστάσεις. Βιοτικές ανάγκες εκάμνανε τον ένα Νε φύγει μακρυά Νέα Υόρκη ή Καναδά. Η αγάπη των βεβαίως δεν ήταν ίδια ως πρίν Έχει ελλαττωθεί η έλξις βαθμηδόν, Έχει ελαττωθεί η έλξις της πολύ. Όμος να χωριστούν, δεν το θελαν αυτοί. Ήταν η περιστάσεις. Ή μήπος καλλιτέχνις εφάνηκεν η Τύχη χωρίζοντας τους τώρα πρίν σβύσει το αίσθημά των, πρίν τους αλλάξει ο Χρόνος, ο ένας γιά τον άλλον θα είναι ως να μένει πάντα των είκοσι τεσσάρων ετών τωραίο παιδί.
  5. Two comments: 1. και μοιάζουμε ύποπτους _____||_____ and we resemble suspects There was a mistake in the text posted in the CD discussion topic - the correct text is in the CD booklet as seen above. 2. με δέκα ονόματα μας πήραν τα καράβια_____||_____ The ships took us aboard under ten different names Could be that the names refer to ten names of the ships? - which would be consistent with the following lines in the next strophe: Πολλές σημαίες στα καράβια μας αλλάξαμε_____||_____ We changed many banners on our ships πολλά ονόματα τους δώσαμε τις νύχτες_____||_____ we gave them many names in the nights
  6. Καλυμέρα σε όλους. Δεν άλλαξα την άποψη μου για το δίσκο. Μόνο να συμπλιρώσω ότι οι φωτογραφείες είναι πολύ ωραίες, ιδιαίτερα αυτή με τη κιθάρα. Και κάποια παρατήρηση γιά το «φανταρικό» τραγουδι. Φαντάρος, φανταράκι. Αλλά και το ναυτάκι ή ο αεροπόρος όλοι που έχουν ανάγκη από προσωπικά τους τραγούδια. Εμείς τα έχουμε: μελαγχολικά ή σοβαρά ή χαρούμενα για συντροφιά ανάλογα με τις καταστάσεις. Και αυτοί τα πρέπει να έχουν για στρατιωτικό βάδισμα ή κάποιο άλλο στόχο να αντέξουν. Αν ξεχνούν οι συνθέτες τούς φαντάρους φτιάχνουνε αυτοί τα δικά τους τραγούδια. Πολύ σωστό: για 2 χρόνια σε ένα παράλογισμό θα ήθελες κάποια ελαφρότητα λίγο και περισσότερο. Και αν είναι 25 χρόνια οπώς σε Ροσικό στράτος - παλιά; Γιαυτό έχουμε τόσο πολλά φανταρικά τραγούδια για όλα γούστα. Και η ίδια μελωδία μπορεί να περάσει απεποχή σε άλλη εποχή με τα λόγια αλλαγμένα ελέφθερα. Γιατί τα λόγια είναι απλά ταιριαστά με τη μελωδία και κάνει θάυματα (αυτό το σημείο είναι σημαντικό): το φανταράκι έχει καποιό περιθώριο να δημεουργήσει ο ίδιος, να πεί τα δικά του λόγια για τη σήμερινή κατάσταση. Εδώ παρακάτω βρίσκετε ένα «φανταρικό» τραγούδι από Ρωσία: ένα παλιό, τουλάχιστον 100 χρόνια. Αλλά και σημερινό: τα παλιά λόγια στο κουπλέ μιλούσανε για έναν φαντάρο να βλέπει μία κοπέλα στα χωράφια, και τα νέα λόγια κάποια αστεία για να πάνε με τη σειρά σε δημόσια λούτρα ή για το κούρεμα ή παρόμοια καθημερινά πράγματα. Μόνο το ρεφρέν δεν άλλαξε: αν και δεν έχει τόσο καθαρή νόημα. Λέει το εξείς: αηδόνη, αηδόνη, μικρό πουλί μου Καναρίνι μου τραγουδάει θλιβερά Ένα δύο τραγουδάει Και η θλίψη δεν είναι σκοτούρα... Πάντως κάνει τη δουλιά αυτό. http://rapidshare.com/files/49466243/solovei2.mp3.html Με θα ρωτήσετε μήπος: τι έχεις εσύ με το φαντάρο; Τι σημασία; Έχω κάτι από το φαντάρο μέσα: πέρασα περισσότερα από 2 και περισσότερα από 25 χρόνια σε ένα σουρεαλιστικό κλίμα της χώρας μου, όταν μάθαμε να γελούσαμε για τους κάθε είδους παραλογισμούς. (Και όσους γέλασαν υπερβολικά τους περίμενε το τρελάδικο). Και σόλη τη χρονικί διάρκεια του «στρατοπέδου» αυτού μάθαμε το χιούμορ μέχρι να έγινε ένα δέυτερο δέρμα γελάμε, γελάμε, αδυνατεί κανείς να σταματάει. Ιδιαίτερα γιατί δεν εξαφανίστηκαν οι παραλογισμοι υπάρχουν πληθώρα αν κοιτάζεις γύρω... Αυτά. Μην ξεχνάτε τον φαντάρο. Και για τον Νταλάρα έυχομαι να συνεχίσει τη τρομερή δουλιά του με πειράματα και τόλμη για να ηχογραφήσει τουλαχιστον 2-3 φορες ένα καινούριο «φανταρικό» τραγούδι! Just couple words about the "soldier" song. Tasos said in a previous post very well that absurdity of the army's daily life requires humor and "can't care less" attitude. Therefore, the seemingly silly song does its job for the servicemen. I agree of course - and added for illustration an old Russian song that survived at least 100 years with the same melody very suitable for the march, but the words have changed according to the times. As someone who grew up in a surrealistic climate of the USSR I understand very well how the "soldier's attitude" saves our days. I have a little of the soldier inside that helps me to identify with this song. We had to deal with absurdity much longer that 2 years, and as a result we learned to laugh so well that can't stop (especially because absurdities are still plenty around - just look...). So, let's not forget the soldiers. And to Dalaras I wish to continue his great job for our and his own enjoyment for at least as long as it would take for him to make 2-3 more recordings of a new soldier song (he joked at a recent concert that a new soldier song must appear every 15 years).
  7. These are my comments in English. This summer brought a miracle! A new personal Dalaras CD - in spite of what the song from the CD said "there are now miracles this summer" (Tha perimeno edo). People say that Dalaras' singing makes average songs into good and perfect. I agree - but the songs from the new CD are far better than average, according to my subjective opinion. Because (again according to my subjective opinion) the works of art can't be judged objectively. The results vary for people of different ages, backgrounds, experiences and, yes - moods. I am lucky to be right now in a mood that perfectly well matches the mood of the new CD. That's why I will post my impressions with some explanations for each song. First, the entire new CD - I liked a lot! It is fresh, the lyrics are interesting without being too serious and boring, the music mostly goes well with the content. And it's optimistic. Some songs are melancholic - but still optimistic. At this point that's what I needed from Dalaras. Other listeners might not be tuned to this kind of music at this time. (It took me couple years to feel that the disk "Sta tragoudia pou sou grafo" talks to me. Well, this time I am luckier. The songs: H Ellada Kaigetai: I like eastern sound and style: turkish, arabic, etc. Therefore, the composer Kiriakos Papadopoulos made three nice songs for me and the likes of me. I think he makes a good team of collaboration with the well-known lyrics writer G. Pavrianos whom I've liked a long time already. Tha perimeno edo: this is one of the two songs written by Hatzigiannis. I liked these songs - because... I prefer Dalaras singing Hatzigiannis to the Hatzigiannis singing Dalaras. And he seems not a bad composer - people say that his songs can get you tired, but I don't listen to the radio, so they sounded fresh enough for me. Omonoia. Nice song, musically and poetically. Agree with the other members who liked it. If only our deeds were not in discord with our kind words and inspiring music... Pikse mia skala sto feggari. Very good - especially for insomniacs. Gives you consolation and optimism, as well. I like S. Gargalas. Nafplio. Beautiful: melancholic and again - optimistic (what can I do: I like this kind of songs that take you to the stars, while both feet are still on the ground (citing the song "H aitia einai esu"). Am I becoming a kind of vermicelli? Se feggaria luphmena. I already said about my feelings toward the composer K.Papadopoulos and his songs. Maybe this is my favorite from the entire disk... H aitia einai esu. The young composer N.Koumpios did a good job. The song might sound a little teenager for me, but ... that's only natural, considering our age difference. Best wishes to him for the future. Xanetai. Pleasant song. Ends with the line: "my soul, heart and eyes - all are weeping". Fortunately for me, the weeping part sounded sweet enough for being touched but still staying cool. I liked it. Mia zoh sto idio traino. No, the "miserable moons" go down to the second place: this song is my favorite! I liked S.Korkolhs in the "Anemoptero", and I like him even better here: him and his piano. And I can't resist trains and their whistles. Ola miloyn gia sena. My comment to the firts song by Hatzigiannis is valid for this one. Polles shmaies. I agree with those who selected this song as one of the best. Only, I wish the music were not that much tragic-dramatic (maybe something in the Malamas style). It seems to me this is a little bit overdone considering the lyrics. But it's a subjective opinion, of course. As for the "soldier" song I would like to post some separate comments - maybe later. I've already said that I liked it though. Thank you very much for your attention. Best wishes to all. Hi, Alona: I am not sure if you have already found out - just in case: the title comes from the song "H aitia einai esu" (Because of you). Happy listening!
  8. Έχει θάυματα αυτό το καλοκαίρι! Είναι ο νέος δίσκος του Νταλάρα. (Η αιτία είναι αυτός όταν τραγουδάει μέτρια τραγούδια και τα κάνει τέλια. Αλλά και δεν είναι καθόλου μέτρια στην πλειονότητά τους). Τον έλαβα χθες και μου άρεσε πάρα πολύ σε πρώτο άκουσμα το βράδη, και ακόμα καλύτερα σε δέυτερο άκουσμα στο τρέξιμο το πρωή δεν λέω ότι «δεν μπορώ να κοιμηθώ αν δεν παίζει ο δίσκος» όπως η Νταλαρόφιλη, αλλά κοιμήθηκα καλύτερα, ενδεχομένως προβλέπωντας το πρωινό άκουσμα. Μου αρέσουν ΟΛΑ τα τραγουδια του δίσκου νομίζω γιατί είναι όλοι διαφορετικοί. Και τα σχόλια μου γιά το ολόκληρο δίσκο και κάθε συγκεκριμένο τραγούδι θα είναι πολύ υποκειμενικά θα προσπαθήσω να το εξηγήσω με κάθε τραγούδι. (Νομίζω δεν μπορεί να είναι αλλιώς σε σχέση με ένα καλλιτεχνηκό έργο: οι απόψεις μας αλλάζουν ανάλογα με την ηλικία, εποχή, εμπειρίες, καταγωγή, διάθεση, κέφι, κλπ. ). Κατά τύχη ταιριάζει όλα αυτά για μένα σε αυτό το δίσκο. Όλοι οι στίχοι μου αρέσουν πραγματικά γιαυτό δεν θα τους σχολιάζω παρακάτω. Όλο το δίσκο - το νιώσω έναν αισιόδοξο δίσκο του οπίου τα τραγούδια απευθύνονται σε μένα. Τον είχα ανάγκη. Η Ελλαδα καίγεται τον θεωρώ το Κ.Παπαδόπουλο έναν πολύ καλό συνθέτη, μου αρέσουν και τα τρία του τραγούδια, «Ο φαντάρος» περιεχόμενο. Και το στιχουργό Γ.Παυριανό τον σέβομαι πριν από καιρό. Μία τυχερή συνεργασία τη νομίζω. (Μου αρέσει γενικά «το τουρκικό ήχο»: τουρκικό, αραβικό, ανατολικό...) Θα περιμένω εδό τα δύο «Χατζηγιαννικά» τραγούδια μου αρέσουν απόλυτα σε ερμινεία του Νταλαρα: προτιμώ να τραγουδάει Ο Νταλάρας το Χατζηγιαννη παρά Ο Χατζηγιάννης το Νταλάρα! Και δεν είναι κακός ως συνθέτης. (Κατάλαβα από τα σχόλια ότι μπορει να γίνει λίγο βαρετό αλλά δεν ακούω το ραδιόφωνο εγώ: για μένα είναι φρέσκα). Ομόνοια Ένα όμορφο τραγούδι. (Πως μπορίες να διαφωνήσεις ; Αν τις πράξεις μας να ταιριάζουν με τα ομορφιά των λόγίων και της μουσικής... ) Ρίξε μια σκάλα στό φεγγάρι Τέλιο τραγούδι: και μουσικά και στιχουργικά. (και ιδιαίτερα για «ξαγρυπνιάκους» - παρηγορητικό αλλά καί αισιόδοξο). Ο Στέργιος Γαργάλας είναι πολύ καλός. Νάυπλιο πολύ ωρέο (μελαγχολικό αλλά και αισιόδοξο: τι να κάνω; Με αυτά με ταξιδέυει ο Νταλάρας προς τα άστρα με τα δύο μου τα πόδια ακόμα σε... έδαφος: γίνομαι κάποιο είδους φιδές; ) Σε φεγγάρια λυπημένα την έγραψα κιόλας παραπάνω την άποψη μου για τον συνθέτη Κ.Παπαδόπουλο και για το ανατολικό ήχο πού μου αρέσει γενικά (μπορει να είναι και η αγαπημένη μου τραγούδι από το δίσκο αυτό). Η αιτία είναι εσύ καλός είναι ο Ν.Κουμπιός ως ένας νεαρός συνθέτης. Το τραγούδι μου άρεσε αν και το θεωρώ λίγο εφηβειτικό, αλλά ανάλογα με την ηλικία του συνθέτη: όλα καλά. Χάνεται ένα ευχάριστο τραγούδι. «Και ψυχη, καρδιά και μάτια όλο κλαίνε» - ευτυχώς όλο κλαίνε με κάποια γλυκιά δάκρυ χωρίς να γίνομαι λυπημένη και δακρυσμένη. Μια ζωή στο ίδιο τραίνο Όχι, «Σε φεγγάρια λυπημένα» πάει στη δέυτερη θέση. Αυτό έιναι το αγαπημένο μου τραγούδι. Μου αρέσει πάρα πολύ ο Σ.Κορκολής από τον «Ανεμόπτερο» και τέλος! Θαρθεί ή δεν θαρθεί μου αρέσει απόλυτα! (Και αγαπώ τρένα και τα σφύρηγμα τους). Όλα μιλούν για σένα ισχύει το ίδιο «Χατζιγιαννικό» σχόλιο παραπάνω. Πολλές σημαίες το επέλεξαν σχεδόν όλοι ως το καλύτερο: συμφωνώ πολύ ωρέο. Θα ήθελα όμως σε μουσικά στοιχεία κάτι λιγότερα δραματικό-τραγικό (με αυτούς στοίχους μου φαίνεται λίγο υπερβολικά). Ως προς το «Φαντάρο» - έχω να πω κάποια λόγια ξεχωριστά (αργότερα). Απλά να επαναλαμβάνω ότι μου άρεσε. Ευχαριστώ αν το έχετε διαβάσει. Και ζητάω συγνώμη για τα λάθη. P.S. Το βιβλαράκι μου έχει όλα τα στοιχεία γραφτά - με τους στοίχους και μουσικόυς για τα δύο τελεφτέα τραγούδια.
  9. Δεν έχει τόση σημασία το ποστ μου, Γογο. Τα έχουν γράψει πολλά πριν από εμένα. Απλά θα ήθελα να συμπληρώσω ότι θεωρώ τον Νταλάρα ελέφθερο να δημιουργήσει όπως θέλει, και εμάς είμαστε ελεφθεροι να ακούσαμε ή μην χωρίς να προτεινούμε σε αυτον να αποχωρήσει από τη μουσική γιατί ο Νταλαρας έχει αποχωρήσει από την εικόνα του, η οπία ζωγραφίθηκε από εμάς ακροατές. Δεω είναι μία εικόνα αυτός είναι ενας άνθροπος. Το νομίζω ένα πολύ καθαρό νόημα. Συγνώμη αν έκανα λάθη στα Ελλινήκα. Μπορεί να είναι, Απόστολη, έχεις το ίδιο πρόβλημα με τα Αγγλικα? Δεν πειράζει. Θα μάθαμε! (Προτείνω να συνεχίσεις να διαβάσεις: λειτοyργεί για μένα με κάθε διάβασμα καταλαβαίνω καλύτερα το γραφτό στα Ελλίνηκά.) Αγάλι, αγάλι, εφύτευεν ο φρόνιμος αμπέλι, και αγάλι, αγάλι, εγίνετο η αγουρίδα μέλι. (Αγάπα τον πλησίον σου με τα ελαττώματά του). Please feel free to reply with some English proverb. It was suggested by some members that Dalaras should think about leaving the musical scene, that he might have lost his creative edge, etc. I think he is free to do his job as he likes it, and we are free to listen to the results or not. He is a free man and artist not an image that we have created, and want for him to stay within that image. P.S. The other topic is not my personal (I started it like many other members have started other topics - and everyone is welcome to participate). People have participated. If others are not interested - It's only natural that the members have different interests in addition to being Dalaras fans. (Dalaras has many interests in addition to his music). Ideas or their expression not clear? - that's why the discussions are for: to get to the truth of the matters. Best wishes to all. Γειά σε όλους!
  10. Έχω διαβάσει τα παραπάνω σχόλια με πολύ εντιαφέρον και ενθουσιασμό με το αποτέλεσμα που έτρεξα να παραγγείλω αυτό το δίσκο αμέσος. (Δεν βιάστικα πριν για κάποιους προσωπικούς λόγους). Είμαι ενθούσιασμένη από την αγάπη της κοινότητας προς έναν καλλητέχνη η οποία έχει προκαλέσει τόσα διαφορετικά σχόλια απ τα πολύ θετηκά μέχρι πολύ αρνητηκά. Νομίζω ότι αμφότερα - τα θετηκά και τα αρνητηκά προέρχονται από την αγάπη. Θέλουμε να μέινει ο αγαπημένος μας τραγουδιστής πάντα στα ψηλά, ο καλήτερος σε κάθε μεριά. Μπορεί να είναι λίγο εγωιστική η αγάπη; (Δεν υπάρχει πρόβλήμα νομίζω γιατί μετά από τόση έντονη συζήτηση έχουμε καταλήξει σε αυτό το συμπέρασμα: είναι ελέυθερος ο καλλιτέχνης να κάνει τη δουλιά του όπως του λέει η καρδιά και η επαγγελματική εμπειρία του). Και εμείς είμαστε ελέυθεροι να ακούσουμε ή μην, να αγοράσουμε ή μην, να εκφράσουμε ελέυθερα τις απόψεις μας με κάποια σύνεση νομίζω: μην προτεινούμε «θα ήτανε καλά αν θα αποφήγει όταν είναι στα ψηλά, γιατί μπορεί να έχει χάσει το δημιουργικό του πνέυμα», κλπ. Το ξέρω ότι οι περισσότεροι θα πούν ότι είναι ανοησίες το παραπάνω, αλλά θα ήθελα να τονίσω συμφονώντας με αυτούς: συχνά χρειγιάζεται αρκετό καιρό να δούμε το δημιουργικό πνέυμα γιατί μπορεί να μέινει κρηφτό πίσο από τον καθρέφτη. Με απλά λόγια: συχνά φταίμε εμείς, αν και δεν φταίμε τελικά. Δεν φταίμε αν έχουμε διαθέσεις σε αυτή η στιγμή (μέρα, μήνα) προς κάποια διαφορετική μουσική: με πάθη και φλόγα αντι με ηρεμία και μελαγχολία, και αντίστροφα, π.χ. Αλλά δεν φταίει και ο καλλιτέχνης. Για το παραπάνω θα υπογραφήσω σε σχέση με «Στα τραγόυδια που σου γράφω». Γιαυτό νιώσω ενθούσιασμένη με τον καινούριο δίσκο θεωρώ ότι θα μου άρεσε: σήμερα ή από καιρό, δεν πειράζει. Απλά πιστέυω στο δημιουργικό πνέυμα του Νταλάρα. Έχω εμπειρίες... Και αν συμφωνόμαστε ότι του σφίγγουνε τα παπούτσια της εμπορικής μουσικής γιατί είναι τόσο εκπληκτικό αν θα του σφίξει ο κορδές του εικόνα του που το έχει δημιουργιθσει κατά χρόνια από εμείς ακροατές;
  11. I had also tried to guess what is it all about - including various meanings of peacocks and birds. And it's certainly interesting all the information from Olga and Annemarie. I personally stumbled over the "thirteen centuries" - I could only find that it corresponds to the time covering a period from the 7th century when Islam appeared on the scene - till the present time. And it did not sound very useful, so I dropped the matter. Now, as it's been brought back to our attention by Annemarie - It would be interesting to discuss it again - not the translation which is adequate enough (except that I think the "Northern wind" from the first version is more accurate of the just "North" of the second version) - but the meanings. I agree with Michael that "he does not do it on purpose" - meaning that he is not trying to confuse us intentionally (and whoever would do such thing, would not deserve to be decyphered). In an article from his book "Einai arrostia ta tragoudia" M.Eleftheriou said with his usual sense of humor that when he started writing poems to be put on music, the composers complained that with his style the singer and the listeners will have to stop after each strophe to ponder what did he mean to say. On the other hand, he does it on purpose: with his laconic style where every word is loaded with meanings. For him it is the only right way. Someone like Eleftheriou writes to make the things clear for himself, not to teach others. The thought's been materialized in words. Now it's our task to deconstruct the words back - to get the thought out. It's never a lossless procedure. Not our fault if we can't get to all the details. The best thing in reading the poetry is a provocation to the mind to think. And if we loose this opportunity because of lack of curiosity - that's our fault ( just some thoughts: in hope of having more discussions). Anyway, a new head-breaking session gave me the following thoughts: - starting from the end: to me it seems that birds and peacocks are not different species, but both represent good forces of hope. (and the title says: "birds of the underworld" - or underground; peacocks are left out because they are of the same species). Therefore, symbols represented by the peacocks are interesting but not that essential. Peacocks emphasize the beauty of the birds, though. - Is it OK with grammar if we say that they do embroidery ("embroidery" also seems more accurate than "stitch") day and night (meaning all the time, in a hurry) rather than FROM light and night? - The following I consider the most important: a key to the poem - in my view. Regarding the special and precise meanings carried by the words in this poem - "poisonous time" struck me like a thunderbolt (well, not necessarily bringing the solution - but an idea, certainly: and of course, might be erroneous) . This makes 13 centuries of Islam not that far-fetched. That time was (and still is - how poets can see through the future? It's amazing) poisoned - poisoned by fear, suspicion, distrust. It was still many years left until the fall of Constantinopole, but the poisonous time started working: clash of civilizations, fear, treachery started long before. "Fear eats the soul" - the title of a Fassbinder movie. It does. I have to stress out that Islam or Christianity is not a problem - not a poison. Poison is fear. In times of war and peace alike, fear makes a person to strike first - afraid that it will be late the next moment. And then there is no end (like now). That's what he wanted to say: it's the first line - poisonous TIME. People are victims - on both sides: until they will be ready to hear "the bitter words hidden in the shell". And someone - from the underworld or underground - might be ready to bring his arc. The arc is "a chest to keep treasure". It does not have to be a specific Arc of Covenant or similar: I saw an expression "κιβωτος του πνευματου", Arc of Spirit. And the poisonous time is ready to grab the arc of spirit and to drink the blood of a person or persons who personify this spirit. It can be a spirit of Vizantium, of Hellenic wisdom, whatever has been lost in the past Golden Age - age of dignity. And it's useless to expect the groom to start a new life with the bride - Hellas. People poisoned by the time will destroy him. The same with the bridal bed: treason is waiting for the groom there. There will be no new life until the time keeps poisoning the people with fear and distrust. Underworld might mean "underground" in a political sense or in a poetic sense or both. - Coming back to the 3d strophe: bitter words of truth are hidden away in a shell. You might want to find it and blow the shell to hear. But nobody wants. And the charms of the sea are hidden in a Northern wind - that can alone bring fresh and cool ideas. But they won't come - and the divine flame of human wisdom or spirit will eventually die out. There will be no home for you to keep warm (spiritually in the first place).
  12. Hi, Christo I don't know what they did 10 years ago. Would you shed some light.? As for my idea- it has something to do with personal commemoration, like dedicate your own achievement to someone you respect very much. And it involves travel to Greece. (this I can leave on my personal list - and join in a communal commemoration that you and others have in mind).
  13. Best wishes to all the members who will be lucky to enjoy the two upcoming concerts! Waiting for impressions (software and hardware) We'll be there in imagination (no problem )
  14. What are you saying, Hristaki! That's where I always stay True, the last time coming from the airport I witnessed a quarrel between a guy and a woman who claimed he tried to snatch her pocketbook. But that's the place I can still afford. When I won't be able any more - I will still come to look for a lodging info: there is a Russian church nearby, and the light poles are all filled with paper fliers offering rooms. And of course, little groups of people speaking many languages including Georgian and Armenian. (might be not too safe to talk to them, too). So far, there have been nothing sad for me about Omonoia (except of having almost frozen to death in a hotel without heating when I've come to see Dalaras in Arena in February 2005. Coming for a weekend from Germany where I was doing some library work and leaving the warm jacket behind was a very stupid thing that deserved to be punished by snow and cold - of course, coming to Greece is always exciting, even when it's snowing. But heat wave in 2003 did not leave bitter feelings.
  15. According to the science of semantics (interpreting meanings expressed by language or codes) - misunderstanding always takes at least two: the one who (mis)expressed and the one who (mis)understood. (nothing important - just a chat. Thanks for the explanation )
  16. In addition to all the useful (and long overdue) propositions by Christo about unreleased records - I think the club fans can think about something original to commemorate the Dalaras anniversary. I have one idea - but won't disclose until seen some more interest. And of course, he is young, and anniversaries can bring bitter feelings, too - especially, when the media is all over you with stupid questions about retirement
  17. Of course, I approve of any improvements, especially done by the others And to be absorbed in a translation of a song would be a pleasure that you must pay for - not to get paid (exactly the right place is here). Debate and discussion makes it at least twice more desirable. But... With all due respect to good intentions expressed above, my imagination can't stop envisioning all kinds of funny and less funny consequences which is no need to describe here in more details. There is no need to describe - because any one who is or used to be involved in this sometimes pleasant and many times boring and exhausting activity, knows... And for the rest it would be enough to read one of the bloodiest Greek tragedy in order to figure out... Still trying to explain the problem as briefly as possible: Is Giannis Ritsos or Odysseas Elythis still available for the job of "Administrator of translations" - to check for integrity? A less high authority simply would not do. It does not mean there should be no debate - just the opposite. Debates and questions and friendly exchange of opinions. It is possible in spite of..... Listening to music is (or can be) a community experience, while making a translation is a lonely endevour such as a birth. You produced a child, and someone tells you that he must have a different hair color or nose shape... No, it can be changed - but such a delicate operation implies various rare conditions such as: you are receptive of other opinions, ready to acknowledge an error, and the suggesting party is willing to take a chance of acquiring an enemy... I am just saying that people are imperfect, their patience is limited, and the translators are even worse than average... So although the Art of Translation can't have rules and regulations (even in our forum, where an agreement exists that translation must be as close as possible to the original, meaning phrase by phrase, and keeping lines in proper order, etc. - it is impossible to get to terms about HOW CLOSE), I will be the first to suggest introducing Rules and Regulations for the Translations section - not for the translation itself, but of course for the debate and discussion. Rule 1: Always agree and never give in. (Fine print: say "thank you" to the helpful suggestion and politely explain why your version is the only correct one. You can always do it within the borders of Art of Translation - because an art has no rules, etc, etc.). Comment: Fine print is a joke, Rule 1 is not. Thank you for your attention. I'll think about more rules. (If it won't work, at least a new Greek tragedy might come out of it).
  18. I would say "a meager repayment" - with your permission
  19. Hi, Alona: It seems you have good knowledge of discography: I am interested in discography of D. Lagios (except of those well-known recordings with participation of Dalaras such as Erotiki prova, Ina ti, etc.). Sorry if my question is misplaced.
  20. I think it should be very interesting - and volunteer to translate!
  21. Incidentally, I was doing a little research on the Maori music - and found this song which is based on the Bible and is supposed to be performed when an important community project is about to be started. I guess it can bind together our two important projects: NEW RULES AND REGULATIONS and the CHARITY COLLECTION. Here it is: E toru nga mea -//-There are three things Nga mea nui -//-very important things E kii ana -//-as stated in Te Paipera -//-the Bible Tumanako -//-Hope Whakapono -//-Faith Ko te mea nui -//-(and) the greatest thing, Ko te aroha -//-Charity. I Corinthians 13:13. And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity.
  22. I did not want to interfere - not because I don't respect honest attempts to make this site a better place. But because of my chaotic way of thinking (some call it associative) I feel more comfortable (and maybe even useful) in a semi-private existential corner. The only reason is that my name was mentioned in a strange context that, in my opinion, is completely irrelevant to my humble person. I'll try to be as much logical as possible at that. I am afraid it is going to be long - sorry about that. So, I will have to make chapters. 1. A comment touching upon personal issues.. Unfortunately, at this point there is no way to pretend that it can be avoided. Even if I won't answer directly to the person quoted in this post. I already said why I had to use this quote. As an individual, I am completely incapable of taking impersonal attitude - I don't know how strange it may seem to others. I can't talk to a faceless mummy. All my relationships are strictly personal. I make generalizations based on my personal attitudes and responses from the environment. During the course of my life, in both real and virtual communities, I've had many more or less successful relationships on various levels: relationships with all kinds of human beings (including my boss). I consider myself a human, meaning - looking at any other human met on my way as a complicated person, with interest and feeling of a warm-blooded creature toward another warm-blooded creature. Expecting a similar attitude - within limits defined by difference in personalities, mentalities, etc. One single time I failed to understand a human so completely that I had to give up attempts on communicating at personal level (I tried). Again, being just a human, I humbly assign this being a status of "super-human" and retreat. Since it makes no sense to be enigmatic when you are trying to explain something that had happened out of the sight of the public, I have to add for clarity that from my side all attempts at communication with the super-human, both in general and in personal posts and messages were guided by good will, love, interest, attention and respect. Everyone has their character, their good and bad moments, their sympathies and antipathies, However, all things condsidered, the negative moments at my receiving end much exceeded any reasonable expectations, and were completely inadequate to my positive attitude. That's why I repeat that I failed to understand and stop at it. 2. My reply to the lines mentioning my name - directed toward the community I came to the forum with open heart. My positive attitude toward a person described in the previous paragraph I can repeat with regard to this forum community. If someone takes a task to look up all my posts - it will be easy to see. My recent post regarding my intention of leaving the forum does not have any negative judgement, except mentioning that the forum became a little cultish, with narrow-minded views. It was written, as you can understand, under distress, and I take it back. I had declared that I am leaving the forum only because of the censorship. And after Nikolas admitted that the deletion was unjustified, I was satisfied. I apologized to those why might have found themselves offended by the joke. I admit that it was in the wrong place and that's why misunderstood. As for the joke content - please tell me what is offensive? I personally would not mind to be referred indirectly as a "Mother or the Father of the forum" or implied that my friendship is a coveted commodity. In just a couple other recent posts I did sound negative - when trying to defend myself or to defend the forum (I am not unconcerned about its situation and development): defend the forum from becoming a clean swept-out yard. That was my opinion - and discussion did not follow: maybe my own fault (way of thinking and expressing myself - see above).But that's enough apologizing: I don't see myself as faultless, but my general attitude has nothing to do with the quoted accusing lines. 3.Couple things to reply to specific persons I think it makes sense to use this opportunity for making some personal replies and statements. Maro said it seemed that "the joke was on us". My sweet friend Maro (You don't mind being called that?), it was on all of us - least we migrate from warm-blooded species toward the cold-blooded ones. I repeat that I hope Apostolis don't hold grudges about the weekend event - not because of calculation regarding possible future favors, but because I just like him very much. You are free not to like me, Apostolis, it won't change my friendly attitude. I think Nicolas is the best Father of the forum. Christos-Regnis, why did you delete your post about existential matters? There was nothing bad in it. We can discuss more at your earliest convenience. About a benefit of putting a face on the post - that's what Celeste said when we met. Hi, Celeste - I agree. Some faces appeared, and some got lost (or maybe they were masks?). Now, I still have to answer to Geeske - regarding those two lines: you would say that you don't know me at a possible meeting? But you've already said it: that you don't have time/interest to know me. What's new? And about "shame on me" - yes, the shame is on me. I feel ashamed for some other people - because I am not an island. As for John mentioned in the same post: he can answer himself of course. The only reason I mention him is that a friend asked me to translate to her the exchange in Greek language regarding John's declaration. I found that most or the posts have been deleted - as an act of goodwill on the both sides. So, this forum is still in good shape. 4. Declaration As many accused who had to defend themselves before me I am tempted to use this opportunity also as a tribune for a declaration. I declare my love and interest to all the members of the forum - with all the consequences. I consider you all friends - without asking permission. I am referring to Maro again - she said: Let's talk about George. Maro, we are talking about George, at this very moment. 5. Joke That's what you've been waiting for, I guess. Actually, it is a natural continuation of the above declaration. A rule of common sense proposed by Geeske (bravo!): "Let the members to behave as they would at any live civilized public place - and to expect the same from the other members". Let's test this rule: Who will return my declaration to me? Or is it not sufficiently civilized attitude? The last but not least There was a claim in the pre-published rules (I think by Apostolis) that each member has right to post in his preferred language. I opted to English - but thought about translating eventually onto Greek (in spite of the insufficient language skills). But I have a better idea. Geeske, why don't you do it? As a last favor to a condemned - or a good will step? You choose (no joke). P.S. The purpose of this post was only to respond to mention of my name in a non-relevant context. I am not expecting any reply - and I don't want it, as it may cause further disturbance and annoyance and distraction from the subject of this forum whatever it may be. I am even tempted to say that maybe this forum is not for me - considering the above? But I still remember the old forum... I haven't changed. A while ago I did not have a feeling of being in the wrong place.
  23. It is funny that few hours after I told John Acriditis that he should stay on the forum to keep it going I have to say my own farewell. I can say the same as John: that I appreciate friendship of the friends in spite of leaving the forum. The reason for my leaving will be easily understood from the following explanation: after I posted an innocent joke in the current discussion on rules and regulations my post was deleted with the following explanation from Apostolis saying that some members did not understand (read: did not like) it. These members are obviously cowards who wont tell it themselves. I have to add that at this moment I agree with someone who had already left after he mentioned that this forum started to resemble a cult, with some fans having very narrow-minded view at life, music and their fellow citizens of the world. However, that is just a fact of life - that a virtual community is similar to a real one in many aspects. What is troubling is censorship that got out of hand. The discussion about possible rules and regulations is a fake one - because censorship is already in full blossom. I will be very surprised if this my message is not deleted again (it would be the 3d time).