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Makis

ΕΦΤΑ ΦΟΡΕΣ// SEVEN TIMES

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ΕΦΤΑ ΦΟΡΕΣ// SEVEN TIMES

Μουσική:Στάμος Σέμσης-Στίχοι:Γιώργος Παυριανός// Music:Stamos Semsis-Lyrics:Giorgos Pavrianos

Ό,τι δεν μπορείς να το ανοίξεις κλείστο// What you cannot open, shut it

κι ό,τι δεν μπορείς να το μασήσεις φτύστο// and what you cannot chew, spit it

ό,τι δεν μπορείς να το δαγκώσεις φιλησέ το// what you cannot bite, kiss it

κι ό,τι έμαθες ως τώρα ξεχασέ το// and what you 've learned up to now forget it

Και να θυμάσαι πάντα αυτό:// And always remember this:

εφτά φορές να πέφτεις και να σηκώνεσαι οχτώ// seven times to fall and eight times to stand up

Ό,τι δεν μπορείς να το αναστήσεις θάψτο// What you cannot bring to life again, bury it

κι ό,τι δεν μπορείς να πεις με λόγια γράψτο// and what you cannot say in words, write it

ό,τι δεν μπορείς να το αντέξεις άντεξέ το// what you cannot stand, try to stand it

κι ό,τι πιο πολύ μισείς αγάπησέ το// and what you hate most, love it

Και να θυμάσαι πάντα αυτό:// And always remember this:

εφτά φορές να πέφτεις και να σηκώνεσαι οχτώ// seven times to fall and eight times to stand up

From the new CD "Στα τραγούδια που σου γράφω" // "In the songs that i write for you"

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Μάκη, ευχαριστώ πάρα πολύ!

well, that's one the worst translations i've ever seen on this forum... I believe anyone of the regular translators in here would have done better.

"seven times to fall and eight times to stand up" is not an english sentence, it's a greek sentence with english words

and "what you cannot stand, try to stand it" is exactly what the original does nOt say

to mention just the worst

I don't know what ms. Anna Nakou was paid for this job but she definitely does not deserve it. And now you know how differently I read a professionally published translation, or a private one.

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Hello, Dalaras Club members. This is my first post after three years as a ROM.

First of all, I must thank all the members posted translations of Mr. Dalaras' songs.

You've helped me very very much understanding strange Greek words and phrases.

I have a question about the phrase

"εφτά φορές να πέφτεις και να σηκώνεσαι οχτώ ".

(Sorry, I don't know how to quote the original line.)

There's a proverb in Japan "nanakorobi-yaoki", and it exacktly means "seven times to fall and eight times to stand up". Japanese dictionaries say this idiom is of Japanese origin (i.e., not borrowed from ancient Chinese sayings). I'd never imagined if the same expression exists in Greek!! Does any Greek member know from when and how this phrase is used?

Many Japanese web sites have English translations of the proverb "nanakorobi-yaoki", such as:

If you fall down seven times, get up eight.

Life is full of ups and downs.

Life has its ups and downs.

If at first you don't succeed, try, try, try again.

If you don't make mistakes you don't make anything.

Every flow has its ebb.

The worst luck now, the better another time.

He that falls today may be up again tomorrow.

A man's walking is succession of fall.

Have nine lives

etc., etc.

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one of the songs that i most like from the new Disc

Thank u For The Lyrics and for the translatlion

I Like very much the "to" in every sentence and how Dalras Pronounce it!!

Dear Geske,hwo know more than u that there's Sentences/words that Exist only in the Greek Language and can't fit in other languages?!

and Thank's also for the Japanese sentences and WELCOME TO THE CLUB!

:D:razz:

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I have a question about the phrase

   "εφτά φορές να πέφτεις και να σηκώνεσαι οχτώ ".

(Sorry, I don't know how to quote the original line.)

There's a proverb in Japan "nanakorobi-yaoki", and it exacktly means "seven times to fall and eight times to stand up".  Japanese dictionaries say this idiom is of Japanese origin (i.e., not borrowed from ancient Chinese sayings).  I'd never imagined if the same expression exists in Greek!!  Does any Greek member know from when and how this phrase is used?

No one who can answer Eiko's question? It would interest me too.

Moreover I have a mathematical problem with this proverb (7 --> 8 ??) :)

Ίσως θα έπρεπε να αποδώσω Eiko's ερώτηση στα ελληνικά:

H Eiko γράφει ότι στα ιαπωνικά υπάρχει ακριβώς η ίδια φράση με το "εφτά φορές να πέφτεις και να σηκώνεσαι οχτώ". Γι αυτό θα την ενδιέφεραν λεπτομέρειες για την ελληνική φράση (από πότε και σε ποιες περιστάσεις χρησιμοποιείται).

And a question to Geske, concerning her posting (referring to the words "ό,τι δεν μπορείς να το αντέξεις άντεξέ το"):

"what you cannot stand, try to stand it" is exactly what the original does nOt say

Why not? I thought that this is exactly the meaning. (Maybe it is not good English - I cannot judge this aspect - but concerning the meaning it seems completely o.k. to me.)

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No one who can answer Eiko's question? It would interest me too

I'm curious too. :music:

Makis has told us in this topic (Makis' post Dec.14/04) that the verse has been used before in a song of Orfeas Peridis written by Stellas Kotsonis who took his inspiration from one of Roland Barthes (French essayist, critic, semiologist, 1915-1980) poems which includes this particular verse.

I tried to find some reference in R. Barthes' work but failed. He has written extensively and I'm not familiar with his work.

So far, I found only one reference to the verse in French :

Philippe Labro (writer, film maker) has made it the title of his last book, an autobiographical work telling about his fight against depression.

Comments on the book say that the verse is taken from a Japanese haiku

Back to Eiko's post !

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Philippe Labro (writer, film maker) has made it the title of his last book, an autobiographical work telling about his fight against depression.

Comments on the book say that the verse is taken from a Japanese haiku

Yes, that's one more indication that the expression originally comes from the Japanese language.

Concerning Barthes, I found out that (among many others) he has written a book about cultural interdependences between Japan and the West. So perhaps he was inspired too by the Japanese proverb when writing his poem. :music:

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Hello, again.

I was back to my home town to look after my parents, and now I'm back here to find this topic has become very academic.

Thanks fadi for the welcome, and thanks Annemarie and Makis for letting me know about Roland Barthes and Philippe Labro. I searched on the net and now I know that Roland Barthes visited Japan three times in the late '60s and in 1970 wrote "L'empire des signes", which describes impressions about his encounter with Japan. Barthes was one of the obstacles I'd run into when I was student. I failed to read his book through and threw it away thirty years ago.

:pity:;)

To Michael, on the mathematical problem, I can tell that for centuries a lot of Japasneses have expressed their considerations on the proverb "Seven times to fall down and eight times to stand up":

Someone says that a man can fall down only when he was on his feet before falling down. When a baby stands up for the first time in its life, the very act should be counted up as the first stand-up in the "nanakorobi-yaoki" cicle. So, the proverb is right in expressing "eight times" after falling down seven times. This explanation is not fully convincing but the last resort in Japan.

Btw, about a century ago there was a odd Japanese Hellenist who insisted that the Japanese people is descended from the ancient Greek people, because the Greek myths and the Japanese myths are alike in some episodes, and in addition to this, almost every Japanese words has its origin in ancient Greek language. He explained his theory in the same way with the Father in the film "MY BIG FAT GREEK WEDDING"!!! His theory crossed my mind when I first read the lyrics of "Efta fores". :rolleyes::rolleyes::confused:

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Barthes was one of the obstacles I'd run into when I was student. I failed to read his book through and threw it away thirty years ago.

:confused::pity:;) you have all my sympathy :rolleyes:

Thank you for the additional information Eiko :rolleyes:

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To Michael, on the mathematical problem, I can tell that for centuries a lot of Japasneses have expressed their considerations on the proverb "Seven times to fall down and eight times to stand up":

Someone says that a man can fall down only when he was on his feet before falling down. When a baby stands up for the first time in its life, the very act should be counted up as the first stand-up in the "nanakorobi-yaoki" cicle.  So, the proverb is right in expressing "eight times" after falling down seven times.  This explanation is not fully convincing but the last resort in Japan.

That's a good and logical explanation. ;) Thank you, Eiko. :music:

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