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franz averstegge

Some thoughts about the club.

183 posts in this topic

Pikerni, don't feel intimidated.

I'm a Greekaddict for years now, admire Dalaras and love his music for so long, other Greek music and still hungry, always.

I'm a slow learner but I learn and sometimes I amaze myself.

What you learn by reading, listening, the passion you put into it, that's what counts not the balance (or im-balance?) between what somebody else knows and what you know.

Micki

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You're right Micki, thanks!

I guess the "hunger" is what we all have in common.  Without it, we wouldn't be here, now would we?!  ;)

Now, here's my first of many stupid questions  :(

Who sings Aggigma Psihis?  For many months I have loved this song, thinking it was Dalaras... but a friend assures me it is not.  I know someone out there will know!

Thanks in advance...

P

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While I agree that English is a pitifully ugly language,

It really depends on who uses the language (written or spoken). ;)

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Who sings Aggigma Psihis?  For many months I have loved this song, thinking it was Dalaras... but a friend assures me it is not.  I know someone out there will know!

You mean the soundtrack of the tv series don't you? It's Mihalis Hatzigiannis (Μιχάλης Χατζηγιάννης). Nice voice!

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Pikerni, your image avatar doesn't seem to be available! I had the same problem two or three weeks ago! If you don't know how to solve the "thing", do contact me! ;)

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Thank you Francois,

I've had a hard time deciding what to use...  I especially love yours.  How'd you do that, anyway?  Very impressive.  If this doesn't work, I will beg for your help.   :)  P

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Is this site still the Dalaras Internet Community I used to read on a very regular basis? I don't know what to think when I read the posts of some members who are transforming it into a chat that you don't even feel like browsing!!!! :confused:

Of course, the interesting parts of the site are still here, but each time I come here, I have to notice that people are quarrelling and almost insulting each other. It's been quite a few weeks since I noticed this.

I come here to read about Dalaras and Greek music, but all I can find today is totally uninteresting chat. Megali apogoitevsi. See, I have learnt some Greek, but I would like to use it to write other stuff than this.

Greetings from Valencia.

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Is this site still the Dalaras Internet Community I used to read on a very regular basis? I don't know what to think when I read the posts of some members who are transforming it into a chat that you don't even feel like browsing!!!! :confused:

Of course, the interesting parts of the site are still here, but each time I come here, I have to notice that people are quarrelling and almost insulting each other. It's been quite a few weeks since I noticed this.

I come here to read about Dalaras and Greek music, but all I can find today is totally uninteresting chat. Megali apogoitevsi. See, I have learnt some Greek, but I would like to use it to write other stuff than this.

Nick, I think that (for a number of reasons) it is not so bad when discussions in the Community take place about other subjects than Dalaras too (even controversial subjects).

To my mind the problem arises when topics are mixed, e.g. when there is a posting about a certain concert of Dalaras and the discussion continues about religion or computer viruses or whatever. It's a problem because people who want to deal only with the first topic/posting will loose the interest in following the (off-topic) discussion and (possibly) in writing postings about the primary subject themselves.

Whatever does not concern Dalaras or Greek music in general should be discussed in the (last) section of the Community called "Dalaras Community" "Γενική συζήτηση General discussion".

(That's the purpose of this section of the Community. The "subtitle" says: "Ας γνωριστούμε καλύτερα! Εδώ συζητάμε οτιδήποτε άλλο, έξω από Νταλάρα και μουσική..." = Let's get to know each other better! Here we discuss about anything else than Dalaras and music ")

And everyone who realizes that within a topic about Dalaras (respectively Greek music in general) arises another discussion (about religion, USA, whatever) should suggest to leave this topic and to continue the discussion within a new topic in the last section of the Community.

And don't forget that everyone is free to start by himself some topic concerning Dalaras. Maybe that there is not always enough material (which has connection with Dalaras) to talk about. So perhaps this is also a reason that people start to discuss about other subjects too.

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Is this site still the Dalaras Internet Community I used to read on a very regular basis? I don't know what to think when I read the posts of some members who are transforming it into a chat that you don't even feel like browsing!!!! :razz:

[...] I come here to read about Dalaras and Greek music, but all I can find today is totally uninteresting chat. Megali apogoitevsi. See, I have learnt some Greek, but I would like to use it to write other stuff than this.

I agree with you totally Nick!!  :confused: It isn't the site we had !!! :pity:

Παιδιά, sorry, but this place is not a democracy.

You can't just stand up and say "I want things to be this way and that way, and I want this, that, and the other to be provided" - and then demand that it be provided for you. Expect the others to make it nice for you.

You have to do it yourself, bring it yourself, make it yourself.

If we don't all do our bit, it will break down.

Well, maybe it is a democracy, after all. :(

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Malista, KATALAVA.

On the other hand, different people , who don't belong into any groups, have so diffrent attitudes and interests, that it is nice and hopeful that if you join a club of say nonsmokers or cat lovers, or of Dalaras lovers, you run a good chance that those people, your co members, will have AT LEAST one interest in common with you,not to speak of the intersts going in groups, that is to say, when someone is a nonsmoker , she is more probably a vegetarian than the smoker. More probably, not neccessarilly...AND THERE IS NORMALLY SOME SYMPATHIA, LIKING, FOR A FELLOW THAT LOVES THE SAME THINGS OR PEOPLE AS YOU DO. NORMALLY, BUT NOT ALWAYS, AS HAS PROVEN.

This is why there SHOULD be the general discussion.

The problem rises when someone writes something that does belong into a topic and accidentally or because it is connected, touches another theme just off hand, and then the response is wide, and the responders widen the theme of the original topic, not the topic starter. Then he responds back and so on...

I can't see how this can be avoided.

In a normal conversation in a group of people called 'party' there are no TOPICS, because it would be artificial and no natural conversation would be posssible, having 'topics'....it is not about democracy or not, it is a natural poria of human conversing...with only limit of not hurting another, but also of ANOTHER NOT HURTING YOU.... :confused:

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The problem rises when someone writes something that does belong into a topic and accidentally or because it is connected, touches another theme just off hand, and then the response is wide, and the responders widen the theme of the original topic, not the topic starter. Then he responds back and so on...

I can't see how this can be avoided.

I have to say I agree with Nikh. And I know I'm one of the members aimed by criticism, but you have to understand that sometimes one thing leads to another and then you notice that it has nothing to do with the original topic. Or should I shut up and let conversation die just because it's a little off course? I didn't know the rules were so strict.

As for the topics you think should not be debated Nick, I think they are precisely in General Discussion and on this point I agree with Michael. And Nick, if you're not interested in that, you can avoid reading it! There's been lots of interesting things said lately on Music. Focus your attention on these ones.

Greetings to valencia! :confused:

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[...] but you have to understand that sometimes one thing leads to another and then you notice that it has nothing to do with the original topic. Or should I shut up and let conversation die just because it's a little off course? I didn't know the rules were so strict.

No, no, Celeste. Not shut up and let conversation die. But you (or everyone else who notices that he gets off-topic, including myself :confused: ) could announce something like: "I will write my answer to your last posting in the section 'Dalaras Internet Community - General discussion', opening a new topic with the title 'XYZ' ."

To my mind that's not a matter of "strict rules" (which I would not like too) but it simply makes easier (and more interesting) the reading of discussions and the active participation.

Without a certain structure in the topics/discussions I fear that for Nick (or any other people) it will be very difficult to put into practice your proposal:

And Nick, if you're not interested in that, you can avoid reading it! There's been lots of interesting things said lately on Music. Focus your attention on these ones.

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This was being discussed once again and again: main topic and digressions or "useless" emoticon posts or even useless saying "thank you" ain a short way after some posts.

Let's take seriously, what Nick and MIchael say.

Opening a new topic, when needed (there was this "Actual" or "This week's topic" mentioned for this mainly).

No quarreling? would be superb.

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You're right, both of you. I just wanted to point that for example, the religion issue was not supposed to be serious, or let's say, I wasn't expecting answers. I was just joking! But I guess those who answered in a more serious way should have done it somewhere else. Anyway, no harm done.

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This forum will develop on and on, in always another direction. So no more trying (not anymore) to brong this forum. For me it has become a place where I will come now and than for Dalaras in the first place and than directly second for the very few people here that make me feel good about myself and that I care about and last but certainly not least for all the good information and some good posts we - thank God - still have.

It probably sounds selfish and arrogant and maybe my attitude will change again (maybe!) but in order to remain loyal to myself I have to do this (take the best out of it and leave the rest alone), just like in real life.

Micki

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Nikolas wrote a little while ago (if I understood it correctly) about the link between the love of Dalaras and his music and the way club members live their lives. Im not sure about that, at least for myself, but what I do know is that in the last two months I have seen the very best of what this forum and, perhaps more, this community can be. Ive encountered the most extraordinary generosity, friendship, understanding and tolerance, and I feel it is no coincidence those qualities exist so strongly in this community. Speaking for myself Ive also listened to, and learned, a great deal from others during this time. Things change of course, but I know that the qualities that made the forum such a special place still exist in abundance.

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Perhaps the discussion is of interest for others too:

Apostolis complained in another topic that the level of this Forum goes down because there also postings about singers like Antzela Dimitriou (a characteristic example for the category which is usually called "commercial" singers). He wrote (translation below):

Ίσος να έχω (λανθασμένα) μεγάλες προσδοκίες από το forum και από τα μέλη του

Αυτό σημαίνει ότι θα ήθελα να κρατήσουμε αυτό το forum σε ένα επίπεδο Βέβαια αυτό δεν είναι δυνατόν για διάφορους λόγους που είναι προφανείς.

Όσον αφορά το επίπεδο, δυστυχώς δεν μπορεί να κρατηθεί σε ένα ανοιχτό forum, γιατί δεν εφαρμόζουμε κανένα είδος λογοκρισίας (και καλά κάνουμε) και επειδή το forum είναι ανοιχτό, αυτό επιτρέπει στον οποιονδήποτε να έρθει και να αρχίσει να μας μιλάει για τον Βαλάντη, τον Τριαντάφυλλο και την Πέγκυ Ζήνα. Γιαυτούς τους λόγους ένα ανοιχτό forum δεν μπορεί να κρατηθεί με κανένα μέσο, σε ένα επιθυμητό επίπεδο.

Translation (sorry Apostoli, for its bad quality but I hope I did not change the contents of your comments):

"Perhaps I have (by mistake) big expectations from the forum and its members ...

That means I would like that we keep the forum on a certain level ... Of course this is not possible for various reasons which are evident."

"Concerning the level, unfortunately it cannot be kept in an open forum because we do not apply any sort of censorship (and this is good so) and as the forum is open, everyone is free to come and to start to talk about Valandis, Triantafyllos and Peggy Zina [these are other pure "commercial" singers in Greece] ... For these reasons an open forum cannot be kept, by no means, on a desirable level."

Apostoli, to my mind the answer to your complaints is simple:

This Forum consists of several parts and in every part people are free to open topics and to write postings - topics and postings on a "high" level or on a "low" level. It depends on yourself, Apostoli, and on all the other members (including myself) what we can read or discuss in the forum.

A topic about Antzela Dimitriou (or any other commercial artist) surely will not inhibit a discussion about (let's say) "The influence of Kougioumtzis' songs on the formation of Dalaras voice" ( :) ) and vice versa.

To tell the truth, there are some topics which belong to the most popular in this Community but they do not contain very substantial postings about Dalaras in special or Greek music in general: "Dedicated", "This week's favourite song", "Birthdays for every one" etc. It's always the same (for months): names, song-titles, congratulations. I do not criticize this and of course whoever is interested to do so may post there. I only want to illustrate that other parts of the Forum could also be accused when someone is not satisfied with its "level".

But I repeat that everyone should try to open topics with contents that seem to him/her important or substantial.

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If I remember well, this must have been Soc, who added this:

"it's a kind of monographic forum, and it's not possible to find substantial stuff to it 365 days and 52 weeks a year".

Therefore

1. some members, who do not post very often and it's their choice;

2. and some ones, including me :) who post more, trying to keep a good level (even making terrible typing mistakes rewriting Greek texts, sorry, my "normal" keyboard) and as clear classification of topics, as possible;

3. and some other ones.

(I was today asked by one of these seldom writing members, where some usually very active persons are lost, and I could make a whole list for this member like:

a.....b.....c.....d.....

Moreover, this confirms (at least for me), that a good amount of members stopped to be only Internet nicks for another ones and this causes also involving other stuff here than only a musical or "cultural" (simplification!) one.

See above, Kate's letter.

A question:

I know, there is still holiday time for many members,

but where is the majority of Greek ones??? Everybody "se magika nisia"?

PS. Apostoli, signomi, it was me asking about Angela Dimitriou, but I was not sure, what kind of artists she might be.

You know, after almost 25 years of listening to Greek music I have still such a huge amount of anonymous voices in my memory, that I have to ask such questions, just to help myself to recognize and to identify them.

Even, if it was not me, who opened the particular topic.

(I am from a country, where everybody knows the melody of "Zorba the Greek", but not everybody has ever heard Theodorakis' name......)

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